Who is the Most Useless Witness Ever?

[dsimons96]

Yea.... I'd bet at least two witnesses are useless...if it is anything like this year

ummm...you mean if it's anything like any year.  

carroll wilson?  emile chadman?  anyone?  

why does everyone have to hate on emile chadman? chadman fit perfectly into the "Tony Kissner is a big fat liar" theme. nothing better than attacking the victim.

danny diehl though - now THAT was a useless witness.

[RadicallyLiberal]

ummm...you mean if it's anything like any year.  

carroll wilson?  emile chadman?  anyone?  

why does everyone have to hate on emile chadman? chadman fit perfectly into the "Tony Kissner is a big fat liar" theme. nothing better than attacking the victim.

danny diehl though - now THAT was a useless witness.

We won 3/4 ballots as the state with Diehl.  The one we lost was a squeaker to UVA.  She almost got an AA and Diehl was a major part of my closing.

Now Erin Harper from Smith v Thompson, that was a useless witness except for one line that sounded like a theme.  (To continue the trend of rebutting uselessness and then nominating a new candidate)

[ItalianTrojan]

We actually used that line from Harper's affidavit as our theme.  Harper was far from worthless from what I can remember.  There was a strong character and plenty of potential to score points.  Substance-wise I would agree that Harper was thin, but there was definitely good character points to be had.

[dsimons96]

my team that year called plaintiff harper all the way through regionals, after which we switched to connell for golds.

how did that harper line go? was it "JJ said he didn't want to take the long way home just so a few kids could have their carnival" - right?

[ItalianTrojan]

J.J. get's bailed out by Harper the day after.  As Harper drops him/her off back at home, J.J. turns to Harper and says, "What if I've become the one thing I said I never would - a drunk who ruins the lives of others?  What if I've become what I hate?"  Overdramatic?  Absolutely.  Unrealistic?  Maybe.  Worth calling over a boring Ryan Stanfield?  You bet.

[dsimons96]

ohhh that line. did u guys always get that in? if i remember correctly we got all mention of alcohol stricken from the case at least once based on the case law.

[FundamentalPrecepts]

Please... Stanfield was a fabulous (and underrated) witness. Sure, he fell asleep in his car, but the fact is he caught JJ near the scene near the time, and Thompson admitted to being in the area. That was killer against the many teams who didn't call the defendant.

[ItalianTrojan]

ohhh that line. did u guys always get that in? if i remember correctly we got all mention of alcohol stricken from the case at least once based on the case law.

We had that problem in one round.  The judge kept out the fact that J.J. was drinking, but he let in the quote.  Then we just crossed J.J. about drinking so that the quote wasn't completely out of context.  

I agree that Stanfield had a lot more substance than Harper.  However, Harper was better for two reasons: first, the potential to score character points were far greater; second, a good Stanfield cross was devastating.  I don't think there was such a thing as a devastating Harper cross.

[FundamentalPrecepts]

What was the caselaw on alcohol again? I don't remember what it said. I do remember always getting it in, though.

I guess I just disagree about Stanfield. We got very big points with him, and the crosser usually didn't do that well. The one time we had to cross a Harper, I think we at least got a good score, though I don't remember for sure.

[ItalianTrojan]

The caselaw was something to the effect that if you didn't have didn't have a breath or blood test result on someone suspected of DUI'ing, then any testimony regarding their drinking is inadmissible.  It usually didn't carry too much weight, but we definitely had to make some adjustments when our Harper direct got sliced in half.

[RadicallyLiberal]

The caselaw was something to the effect that if you didn't have didn't have a breath or blood test result on someone suspected of DUI'ing, then any testimony regarding their drinking is inadmissible.  It usually didn't carry too much weight, but we definitely had to make some adjustments when our Harper direct got sliced in half.

That can't be right, it wasn't nearly so simple.  And besides, didn't JJ have a blood test an hour after the fact, and there was some question as to how high it had been the hour previous?

[FundamentalPrecepts]

I just remembered that I have this case on my computer, so I looked it up.

STATE v. TINIUS  527 N.W.2d 414 (App. 1994)

In order for alcohol to be considered as a factor in wrongful death suits, the plaintiff must show that the defendant unintentionally caused the death of another by operating a motor vehicle while intoxicated or while having alcohol concentration of .08 or more.

The key language was the word "or," as I recall. I remember in one round (maybe vs. Central in DM), I got to have some fun and tell the judge that opposing counsel was mischaracterizing the caselaw by leaving out the all-important words "while intoxicated or" when she objected and explained her argument.

[dsimons96]

i remember my teammate eloquently harping on the "or" by explaining that "the language of state vs. Tinius is disjunctive." as a freshman damned if i knew what she was talking about but it sure sounded good.

[The Mind Of Spinoza]

I just remembered that I have this case on my computer, so I looked it up.

STATE v. TINIUS  527 N.W.2d 414 (App. 1994)

In order for alcohol to be considered as a factor in wrongful death suits, the plaintiff must show that the defendant unintentionally caused the death of another by operating a motor vehicle while intoxicated or while having alcohol concentration of .08 or more.

The key language was the word "or," as I recall. I remember in one round (maybe vs. Central in DM), I got to have some fun and tell the judge that opposing counsel was mischaracterizing the caselaw by leaving out the all-important words "while intoxicated or" when she objected and explained her argument.

You know, I remember facing that exact same Central team that tournament when they called a plaintiff Harper.  I remember telling the attorney who was crossing Harper for the first time ever (God, I should have done that one myself) to object to that very thing.  I remember sitting at one of those crappy splintering tables in the Drake rooms flipping out when she kept her ass in her chair the whole time...

DrCornelius, quotequeen, and others can back me up on how much I wanted to kill things.  

Although, then again, it was the last time I ever had to hear the greatest theme *ever* - "The plaintiff's case is full of mistakes."  Oy.

[FundamentalPrecepts]

I don't remember what either of our themes were that year, but I do vaguely remember the signs one. I'm sure our defense closer used it in some goofy way or another.